Is the dividend cap now optional?

[Jeff Mowatt]

That at least was the impression gained on reading about a small scale hydro initiative, which afaics hasn't been discussed here

 

My immediate thoughts were about NHS trusts and my own efforts to develop a local energy initiative.  In both cases,  proposing a CIC form could have negative impact.  My community might reasonably suggest that they weren't going to get what they were being sold on surplus revenue being re-invested in other community initiatves.     

[John Mulkerrin]

Easy Jeff, you'll start scaring the natives with headlines like that!

 

We actually posted on this on 4/8, four days before the article in your link first appeared http://cicassoc.ning.com/forum/topics/h2ope-cic-secure-ground-break...

 

Nothing really to discuss in many ways, the article basically shows that an investment that wasnt likely under the old Dividend caps went ahead under the new Cap limits. Bravo to all concerned if you ask me, alongside the other equity investments that are happening at the moment this article shows that the share CIC can and is bringing new investment into the social economy. 

 

The Regulator will be holding a full review next year, so that will be an excellent time to feed in your thoughts, personally I think the equity caps are set a a reasonable level, liquidity is the real issue for me (but then that is the real problem for almost all small business shares). 

 

the end of the beginning me old mate :-)

 

 

 

 

[Jeff Mowatt]

OK John, I get the (new) picture.

 

If renewable energy projects take your interest, here's how I plan to deploy the P-CED social business model with an... which accommodates investment of sweat equity. 

 

In this approach,  Ideally no dividend will be distributed and the surplus will be re-invested in social objectives, to meet the Yunus definition of 'social business'

 

It may be feasible to relax dividend distribution, such that our constraint of at least 50% re-investment into the community is met, should it be a matter of approaching a commercial investor. Ideally this will not be the case and funding will be acquired on an asset sharing basis which takes into account th e contribution of 'money's worth' from those who invest their labour.       

[John Mulkerrin]

Hi Jeff

 

interesting, hows it progressing? Seems to be an area of growing activity for all types of community business, im naive to many of the 'soft facts' but the 'fundamentals' around renewables all seem to point to a lot of activity! Aero, Hydro, Pv......im coming across more and more great examples. Ive been looking at the feedback tariffs and they are going to make a lot of ideas viable, but as I said im a little naive to much of the 'soft facts'........it is an area that social investment works wonderfully IMHO

 

 

 

[Jeff Mowatt]

We await a decision on selection for RDPE startup funding John.

In truth, although the model offers a sustainable approach the start-up costs are significant and not easily met by a given community.

The reasoning is that, given RHI incentives exists and will typically benefit only those most able to afford such investment, why not make the benefit available to all the community, even those who have only their labour to invest.

There's a shift developing toward sustainable localised economies as P-CED advocates and we can show how this fits in with the localism bill, community re-investment and social enterprise in a post growth model, as I attempt to get across here. 

[Gareth Hart]

Hi

 

Just wondered - how do we get involved in any consultation on the review next year? I assume stuff will be posted here and on CIC regulator site but is there any avenues for consultation already open?

 

Cheers

 

Gareth Hart

Director, Iridescent Ideas CIC

[John Mulkerrin]

Hi Gareth

 

Yes there is, further to previous work the Regulator has held two technical panels this year on the subject. Ive been gathering information/opinion from members on this and am happy to have a discussion with you on what has happened so far, am also happy to include any info/opinions you have into my messaging, alternatively send an email direct to the Regulator at  [e-mail] .

 

there are lots of discussions in the Forums that include an element on investment, here is the response to Cabinet Office Consultation Supporting A Stronger Civil Society Nov 2010: the really good news on this is suggestion 1 is being actively considered within the wider financial services review.

http://cicassoc.ning.com/profiles/blogs/cic-association-cic-response-t

 

and here is a thread going back to Jan 2009 on increasing investment opportunities for CICs

http://cicassoc.ning.com/forum/topics/increasing-investment

 

John

 

 

 

http://cicassoc.ning.com/forum/topics/increasing-investment

[Gareth Hart]

Brilliant - thanks for this John. I'll have a read through this stuff and get back in touch. Had an interesting session with Big Society Capital and their thoughts on equity were very pertinent to the CIC CLS model. I've posted some thoughts about that here: http://www.iridescentideas.com/blog/14-9-11-barriers-to-social-inve...

 

Essentially I think simplifying the cap would be a good thing! But of course, I get the need to balance return with protecting the community benefit point.

 

Cheers

 

Gareth

 

Gareth